How could we know?
I am still musing over Jazz's feet. I can't help wondering now just how much it has affected him over the last year - having feet that seem, in spite of his perfect ability to walk on them, as if they were not 100% fully attached to his bones. I would say I feel guilty, but that wouldn't be the right word. I feel angry, mostly, I think. Because we didn't know how much not being able to breathe was affecting him physically, and there was no way he could tell us. He has such huge movement, and all four feet were equally affected. So there was simply no way to see that he may have been suffering from slightly achey feet a lot of the time. But it would certainly explain why he used to jump for a certain period of time and then start refusing - persumably when his feet started to ache. And it also explains why he now walks as if he owns the entire planet, and his trot and canter are even bigger than they were before. But how on earth were we supposed to know that a horse that already moved bigger than anything I'd ever sat on was supposed to be moving even bigger?!?!?? So few horses are worked seriously unshod. I wonder if there is another horse anywhere in the world that is working at his level, unshod, and had a tieback. This simply isn't documented anywhere!
Well we know now. I've sent my vet a note about it. Jazz is a nappy horse, and an opinionated one, but some of his problems were almost certainly the physical affect that not having sufficient oxygen was having on his body. What a good boy he was to do as much as he did for me.
Anyway, back to yesterday, since I haven't ridden today (rain, wind, cold, no need to get fit to hunt, not good for either of them doing tiny circles indoors again).
Zip has regained his natural balance after his growth spurt and is working in an unbelievable, natural, outline for a boy his age. He is developing a crest that looks very like a young stallion's ! Yesterday he was so.o.o.oo keen to trot - I had to keep asking him and asking him to stay in walk. When I did let him trot it was gorgeous stuff, before even taking into account how young he is.
He is not eating this last day or so - I think that he is cutting a big cheek tooth. He is bright and chirpy, but just not interested in cubes. He should be OK in a day or so. Following the addition of the chalk to his feed, I would say that his droppings are noticeably larger in size - don't ask me for a photo! You can see where several little ones are now squeezing together to make one bigger one. Previously they would have stayed as three. So I think we can say that he was definitely affected by stomach acid, and that for him the chalk appears to be enough to balance him up.
Yesterday Jazz "got" canter-to-walk on what is, I think, his fourth training session. I have been cantering for 5 strides and then coming back down, and yesterday he cottoned on to that completely. That meant he was holding himself together for the five strides and balanced ready to come out of it. I felt him achieve that point, then "stopped" cantering, and he stopped with me, straight into walk. Bang! Superb!!
The actual aid, best I can decribe it, is to release my thighs from the saddle and let my two seat bones drop onto it. Hardly any rein aid is required, he just dropped straight into a walk. I'm tickled pink, I love canter to walk, it's such a "nice" transition :-)
C.
posted by cptrayes @ 2:32 PM
15 comments
15 Comments:
i used to like walk to canter back in the day... never actually tried canter to walk!
Thinking about it, Jazz's feet is the sort of story my farrier would love to hear of, he's doing a dissertation or something (he's a remedial farrier, trains others - and keeps failing apprentices! - and barefoot is not a problem to him at all); do you mind if I tell him?
Claire I would love you to tell him. I'd love to show them to him (he might have to travel, they don't unscrew :-) I think this needs to get "out there" somehow.
There is a huge amount happening with barefoot horses that is not in the textbooks, and that often people have never even heard of before...Jazz's event line is a good example, and we (UKNHCP bods as a group and individually!) keep throwing questions to the experts (nutritionists, vets, researchers etc) who are usually interested but have never come across that particular thing before (!)...
In some ways its nice to be at the cutting edge, but OTOH it makes it hard to get answers!
I too was thinking that this needs to get out and not just to farriers but to veterinarians too as the cause is not in his foot. I plan to email a neighborhood girl from Colorado who is studying to be a vet. I know she would be very interested! So many things we don't know about horses, physical problems that affect their behavior.
ML
surprises me that similar changes wouldn't be noticed in any horse that was oxygen deprived.... shod or not!
It wouldn't show in a shod horse, Claire, because their feet are permanently short of oxygen, so there would be no strong effect. Also they'd have their shoes off for the operation and the six weeks recuperation, probably, and everyone would put it down to that.
ML feel free to give her my contact details.
Nic, it's like you and I when we started what became the barefoot forum on EE - nerve wracking and exciting at the same time to be recording things that other people never even knew about - I remember comparing notes with you about the 10p piece of sole callous that grows over the point of the pedal bone in horses with thin soles - and then just drops out whole when they don't need it any more!! I was scared witless when bits of Scooby's feet starting falling off :-)
C
Wow those pics!
Poor Jazz, he's really been rather honest not to have reacted worse now that all these side effects due to the lack of oxygen are becoming more apparent.
I trimmed my mates horse's today(she missed her trimmer this time round),one of the old horse's she's looking after for her boss has similar growth to that of Jazz but its definately dietary, he was pretty neglected and poor when he arrived.
"It wouldn't show in a shod horse, Claire, because their feet are permanently short of oxygen"
Ah. didn't know that. Not one whose read hugely round the subject and don't do my own!!!!
so next question - why does shoeing make a foot short of oxygen? perhaps a link to some reading....
The quick answer, without the biomechanics textbook, is that the act of shoeing lifts the frog off the floor. The horse's leg has no muscle below the knee/hock, so there is nothing to squeeze blood back up the leg, as there is in a human. If the natural pumping action of the frog pressing on the floor is also removed, you simply can't get enough blood back out of the foot to let newly oxygenated stuff in quickly enough.
A barefoot horse usually grows foot at least 50% faster than a shod horse because of it. (have a look again at the photos - Jazz has grown that much foot in 8 weeks - you'd rarely see that much in a shod horse). The first time any horse is shod, the shoes usually need refitting after 3 weeks because of foot growth. Then the loss of circulation cuts in and the next set and all the rest will usually last at least 6 weeks because of the slower growth.
Muriel's blog has a good list of barefoot sites on the bottom right hand side of the page.
They are a bit shocking, aren't they Nicola? Certainly not what I expected to see!
C
Fascinating. As i struggle along with Tucker and his lost shoes, I am very interested in the barefoot experience. The fact that Jazz is going so much better with his stride and attitude now certainly underlines how much his breathing affected his whole body.
I do know there are some efforts at using hyperbaric chambers to help heal and treat all kinds of human illnesses. My knee doctor injected ozone into my knees to help with the stem cell therapy.
Who knows where else using oxygen based treatments will lead. Jazz can be an equine poster child for air! *G*
I'd love to be brave enough to take Vigo barefoot but I simply don't know enough about horse's feet to do so with any confidence (in fact I know nothing really about their feet which is odd for me as usually I like to be the know-all!)
All these references to 50p pieces of sole, P1 and P2 angles...whoosh right over my head.
However, i'm pleased to hear that sorting Jazz's breathing has addressed so many of his issues. You should be proud of yourslef Caroline that you listen to your horse. So many of us don't. I include myself in that - Robin has been diagnosed with navicular which is such a cop out diagnosis but he's had 'sore feet' for about 1.5 years and I kept blaming it on thin soles and stoney ground. he must have been in a lot of discomfort and I hate myself for that. I kept disguising the symptoms with silicone pads in his feet because it meant I could keep riding him. Not good.
Still so much to learn..will check out ML's blog for links..
Hi, good pictures Caroline. It could be oxygen, but could be the lack of grass over the recouperation period? New growth will always be tighter initially, but time will tell if the 1st inch starts to flare further down the hoof now he's back on grass. I've found dramatic improvements on many tricky horses once their access to grass is curtailed. Lets see what they look like in a few months.
Tracey B
You've set the cat among the pigeons on this one, Caroline :-)
Anon, all the symptoms you have listed are ones that have appeared in a huge number of horses I have seen professionally (I am a UKNHCP trimmer), and most can be radically improved. There is lots of research out there and lots of information - including the site Caroline and I set up years ago - www.barefoothorses.co.uk and my own site, www.rockleyfarm.co.uk
Hope you find them helpful :-)
On the hoof growth rate, a hard-working barefoot horse will typically grow a whole hoof capsule in around 5 months, compared to 9-12 for a shod horse.
Claire, you find that hoof temperature rises in a horse very often once its shoes come off, and a barefoot horses feet (when healthy) will be a similar temperature to the rest of its body rather than cold, as there is usually better circulation (provided diet and environment are right).
Cassie, (Vigo the new horse - lovely name!) I am evangelical about shoeless, but I know that my circumstances are far from normal and that for many people it would simply be impossible to do without shoes. You want to be able to compete Vigo in conditions where boots will not be allowed (affiliated dressage, eventing) and you work full time. You don't have the time, turnout conditions or the riding surfaces that I do. Don't blame yourself too much - if Robin was sound in pads then he wasn't in pain.
Jean this is certainly a fascinating journey for me - not what I expected at all!
Tracey I strongly suspect that what you wrote was partly motivated by wanting to relieve my feelings of guilt :-) If so, thanks, you're a gem! But I didn't post until I was sure that it wasn't grass. The line was obvious within days of bringing him home - a deep, deep "groove" or what I thought was a groove. I waited for the "groove" to grow down, only to find that it wasn't a groove, more of a "shelf" :-0 He was only off grass for 2 weeks. It hasn't changed since he went back onto grass. His feet didn't change last year when he was turned out daily after being on 24 hour box keep for at least 3 months. And they didn't change this spring when the grass kicked in or when he went out full time and I knocked off the hard food. I'm as certain as I can be that this is the blood aeration levels, gobsmacking as I find that conclusion!
If so, I would expect him to behave very much like a horse coming out of shoes, and for his feet to "wake up" in the coming weeks. It wouldn't surprise me if he abcessed. He felt the stoney track we were on today a couple of times, and I think that's not normal for him, but it would fit.
I must get you some photos of the cracks - he has quite a number of costmetic, vertical, very shallow, cracks in his feet, and every one of them now stops dead at the event line.
C
"hyperbaric chambers to help heal and treat all kinds of human illnesses"
that's why wayne rooney's broken foot mended in jig time so he could play in the world cup, where mine's still broken 17 months later....same fracture. ( i smoke, of course, so oxygen deprivation to my feet? probably :-))
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